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Comment on Week in review – politics and policy edition by genghiscunn

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A couple of pieces the Pope should read in today’s Australian. Andrew Smith of Shell notes: “…we must remember that no nation has prospered or progressed by demonising, or stopping its citizens accessing, the most cost-efficient forms of ¬energy. Rather, we must factor into our choices the carbon impact of the energy we use. … Economic sustainability can be delivered only by creating the right balance and encouraging consumer choice, which in turn will deliver politically sustainable outcomes. All participants in our national energy debate should remember that moves to remove consumer choice or value will ultimately fail and in the process hamper Australia’s prosperity, putting at risk jobs for our children.

[My letter to The Australian on this: “Andrew Smith’s article is timely and excellent, except for one thing. I disagree with Smith’s assertion that no reasonable voice would suggest that as a society we should ignore sustainability. The nature of existence is constant change: nothing is sustainable. We need a mindset attuned to responding positively to our ever-changing world, not one which assumes that we should be constrained by existing parameters.”]

Brett Hogan of the IPA writes: “It is clearly just as important to people in India and the developing world as it is to people in Australia that their electricity system is reliable and affordable. Yet while the Indian government is pursuing policies to provide a higher standard of living for its people, Australian coal activists want to deny them that choice. The morality of seeking to deny people in other countries the privileges that we enjoy here, when we have to ability to help out, is deeply suspect.

“While solar and wind power may very well have a place in future world energy supply, not even the most earnest activist can change the laws of physics and force solar power to work at night or in cloudy weather, wind power to work in calm conditions, or hydro-electric power to work in times of drought or in areas without large rivers or mountains. Increasing the supply of Australian coal to India would permanently improve the lives of millions of people — a goal worthy of strong public and policymaker support.”

http://www.theaustralian.com.au/opinion/meeting-energy-needs-must-remain-a-matter-of-choice/story-e6frg6zo-1227408623949

http://www.theaustralian.com.au/business/opinion/increasing-coal-export-to-energy-hungry-india-a-worthy-cause/story-e6frg9if-1227408537859

Faustino


Comment on Week in review – politics and policy edition by Jim D

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TE, so you think China has already peaked, somewhat in contrast to their plan to peak around 2030. Well, we can see how that turns out, but I think pressure is needed to keep them to their commitment. India and Africa can be persuaded to go with cleaner forms of energy as part of a global agreement too. This is where Paris can help. You should support these mitigation processes because they don’t just happen by themselves. Similarly within the US, despite the cheapness of natural gas, there is still an active lobby against the EPA as they try to move states away from the dirtier forms of energy.

Comment on Week in review – politics and policy edition by richardswarthout

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Mosomoso

You’re right. I am a devoted Catholic and a lay minister in the church. This pope is an embarrassment, but fortunately encyclicals carry little weight. And this one has enough equivocal and confusing statements to be filed in the category of unimportant, unrealistic, and soon to be forgotten documents.

Congratulations to you, Beth, and all our friends down under on the football win over Brazil.

Richard

Comment on Week in review – politics and policy edition by justinwonder

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I don’t feel any need to be consistent with the statements of other “skeptics”. I consider myself not gullible. As for peak oil, it is nothing to worry about. Prices have been very stable despite massive growth in India and China. If oil becomes scarce ( expensive), we will find other sources of energy. I like Jim Hansen’s position on nuclear power. He is very worried about CAWG, but I think he is right about nuclear.

Comment on Week in review – politics and policy edition by richardswarthout

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I’m watching the news and the gatherings in Charleston South Carolina. The people are coming together in prayer and unity. Sometimes we see, after mass shootings and the deaths of African-Americans, protests and violence. But this is not happening in Charleston. In fact, just the opposite. It is pleasing to see.

Richard

Comment on Week in review – politics and policy edition by Mike Flynn

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Jim D,

I’m pretty sure there was no ice when the seas were still boiling, regardless of the amounts of CO2 in the atmosphere.

I’m not sure why Warmists love ice so much. Plants don’t, animals don’t, in general.

Sea levels rise and fall as the crust moves. As the crustal mass is conserved, an uplift above the geoid must be offset by a compensating depression. If this depression is decreased in crustal area, it must perforce be deeper, thus an uplift may result in sea level depression ranging from mild or almost unnoticeable, to extreme fall in apparent sea level.

This phenomena is easily demonstrated with a bucket or similar waterproof container, sand, enough water to cover the sand, and your hands. Start moving sand from below the water level to create continents. Remove more to create mountains. Take it from your ocean basin over a wide area, or from a deep hole.

You will quickly see what I mean.

Now bear it mind that as the crust continues to cool, it gets thicker. The solidified matter occupies less volume than the molten rock. It shrinks. As it shrinks, it deforms or wrinkles. However, the water on top changes proportionally less in volume. This has interesting ramifications.

I’m with Svante Arrhenius. He hoped for a warmer world. More comfortable, more plants (even weeds, which are only plants you don’t like!). Warmists seem to like cold, misery, and disaster.

Not me.

Comment on Week in review – politics and policy edition by GaryM

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mosomoso,

“Now, how does this airhead pope (or whoever writes his material) expect those third world bills to be paid ‘by significantly limiting their consumption of non-renewable energy’ in the developed world?”

My understanding of the process is that a lot of the writing is done first by underlings in the Vatican. But the final product undoubtedly reflects the thought (or lack thereof) of the Pope. He has to approve the final draft. And this document is frankly an embarrassing effort.

I have seen defenses in various sites on the web, and they invariably discuss only select passages of the encyclical. No conservative or skeptic that I have seen is actually defending the economic and historical illiteracy that permeates this monstrosity (including the passage you point out).

My impression of the man about two years into his papacy is that of one who makes a great show of humility (staying in a small apartment, no Popemobile) while demonstrating intellectual vanity, not in the principles he supports, but in his own ability to ‘fix’ the world. He is rather clearly in the process of purging the Vatican of conservative dissent.

Like the typical hard left progressive, he is confident that he and those like him could run the world much better than the stupid saps who vote in elections. He is like a modern Pharisee, whose self-perceived superiority is defined not by his adherence to biblical mandates, but by devotion to the dictates of political progressivism.

Comment on Week in review – politics and policy edition by Willard


Comment on Week in review – politics and policy edition by Willard

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> All the arguments were entailed in Florence Nightingale’s debates with the British Army; as well as the policy debates that followed Benjamin Franklin’s invention of the “lightning rod”. You can go back to the Plague Year of The Restoration for such debates; as well as the Athenian epidemic during the Peloponnesian War.

As Eli says, “post-normal” is actually pre-normal.

MattStat agreeing with Eli: you’ve heard it at Judy’s!

Comment on Week in review – politics and policy edition by Mike Flynn

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RiHo08,

But it gets worse –

USA, 2013 : “According to a new study just out from the prestigious Journal of Patient Safety, four times as many people die from preventable medical errors than we thought, as many as 440,000 a year.”

The deaths from adverse weather, drugs, and utomobile accidents, all put together, rather pale into insignificance don’t they?

Where are the billions of dollars in research to find a cure for this avoidable death toll? Gone into the black hole of “climate research”, of course!

We probably get what we deserve, which may be not much at all!

Comment on Week in review – politics and policy edition by Steven Mosher

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“Post Normal Science, which tends to involve the government on issues of science. Post Normal Science is a misnomer. It should have been called Post Normal Politics.”

Government is always and forever involved in the issues of science.
People, especially grown ass denizens, need to forget the fairy tale they were told about science being free from influence.

Comment on Week in review – politics and policy edition by Steven Mosher

Comment on Week in review – politics and policy edition by beththeserf

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A glowing salt lamp when the sun goes down
and a glass of wine, Justin, helps against the
Sunlight Depravation Melancholy Dane Syndrome.

Comment on Week in review – politics and policy edition by Turbulent Eddie

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Well, we’d agree that Africa, India and some of other developing Asian nations are where development will lead to increases. Fortunately, natural gas is cheaper than coal but perhaps not readily available in those places. If governments could agree on appropriate trade deals, simply developing with nat gas as opposed to coal would be a big help. And that probably doesn’t need heavy handed taxation, prohibitive rules or subsidies, just prudent policy toward what’s already the cheapest fuel.

Comment on Week in review – politics and policy edition by Danny Thomas

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Huh? I thought the new term was “projections” and not predictions.

And only in this case is falsifiability of future events a concern?

The harder I read here, the more I learn.


Comment on Week in review – politics and policy edition by beththeserf

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Understandable the Pope’s stand on abortion but not
on contraception. Most families don’t go fer the round
dozen, I’d surmise, and hard on third world women who
might prefer just two or three children.

Comment on Week in review – politics and policy edition by beththeserf

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Richard,
Thanks fer congrats on football win.
Serf down under.

Comment on Week in review – politics and policy edition by David L. Hagen

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<b>Biased Advisors</b> The Pope's greatest error was in excluding advisors who did not agree with the climate alarmists (atheists) who had his ear. <a href="http://biblehub.com/proverbs/15-22.htm" rel="nofollow">Plans fail for lack of counsel, but with many advisers they succeed.</a> The Pope has rudimentary training in chemistry, but appears not to have applied that or critically read the document in his name. <a href="http://www.cornwallalliance.org/2015/06/17/is-pope-francis-a-chemist/" / rel="nofollow">Is Pope Francis a Chemist?</a>

Comment on Week in review – politics and policy edition by David L. Hagen

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<a href="http://www.cornwallalliance.org/2015/06/18/whats-more-infallible-the-pope-or-the-climate-models/" / rel="nofollow">What’s more infallible? The Pope or the climate models?</a> <blockquote>We are presently seeing a disturbing warming of the climatic system</blockquote> Laudato Si Section 23 <a href="http://www.cornwallalliance.org/wp-content/uploads/2015/06/Pope-vs-18-years-6-months.jpg" rel="nofollow">There has been no global warming for 18 years 6 months! from RSS data.</a> <a href="http://www.telegraph.co.uk/comment/11688994/The-Pope-joins-the-EU-in-a-sad-world-of-make-believe.html" rel="nofollow">The Pope joins the EU in a sad world of make believe</a> <blockquote>There are two great acts of political make-believe in our time, so all-pervasive that it is hard for us to grasp just how much effect they are having on our lives . . .When future historians come to look back on our age, few things will puzzle them more than the extent to which our politics became so dominated and bedevilled by two belief-systems, each based on an obsessive attempt to force into being an immensely complicated political construct which defied economic, psychological and scientific reality. One of these was the peculiar way in which Europe’s politicians, with full support from the US, had set out to unite their continent under a form of supra-national government unlike anything the world had seen before. The other was the way those same politicians fell for the idea not just that human activities were disastrously changing Earth’s climate, but that by taking the most drastic measures they could somehow change it back again. . . . The essence of the “European” fantasy was not just that it could gradually weld all Europe together in “ever closer union” by overriding and eliminating the kind of nationalism which had led to wars; but that it could continually expand its own “empire”. We now see in all directions how that sense of national interest cannot be eliminated. . . . Similarly, the last desperate throw by the EU and the US to achieve a world agreement next December to “halt climate change” is not going to succeed, not just because the “science” on which it is based is so increasingly questionable, but because the emerging powers of the East, led by India and China, are simply not prepared to go along with it. If the West wishes to commit economic suicide, so be it. In their own national interest, they are not willing to follow. . . .</blockquote>

Comment on State of the climate debate in the U.S. by Weekly Climate and Energy News Roundup #184 | Watts Up With That?

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