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Comment on Mark Steyn’s new book on Michael Mann by matthewrmarler

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Brandon S? (@Corpus_no_Logos): In another case, Steyn wrote an article in which he said nobody had ever compared Michael Mann to a child molester.

I put up the exact quote elsewhere in this discussion. The phrase “except for …” makes clear that it is not a “comparison”. Others have quoted the editorial at greater length. The use of “Sandusky” and “Mann” in the same sentence draws attention to the incompetence and venality of the Penn State committed that “investigated” and “exonerated” the two men.

Everyone knows now that the investigation of Sandusky was a travesty; does not the investigation of Mann by the same people likewise require a re-investigation by an independent agent (e.g. a federal district attorney v via a grand jury)?


Comment on Mark Steyn’s new book on Michael Mann by Jim D

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Satire is legally protected against defamation suits on the grounds that it is not done with malice and it is not coming from someone that a reasonable person would believe on the subject. However, Steyn isn’t claiming it is just satire, which is why this is going so far.

Comment on ‘Climate culture’ versus ‘knowing disbelief’ by richardswarthout

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Justin

Interesting. Have lately come to conclude the same; that all people are irrational. Did so though purely by osmosis; no reading about it. Pleased to hear that some intellectuals confirm it.

Richard

Comment on Week in review – science edition by captdallas2 0.8 +/- 0.3

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Here is a neat q&a,

Q: What’s your opinion on the role of coal-fired power generation in medium- and long-term energy supply mix and state environmental protection work in China?

A: A coal-dominated energy mix in China is inevitable to ensure China’s energy security. Therefore, to reduce environmental pollution to the greatest extent, a similar proportion of improvements to coal-fired power plant emissions and implementation of clean coal power generation are also inevitable. Chinese coal consumption for electricity generation accounts for a little more than 50% of all coal consumption, which is far lower than the percentage in developed countries and even the global average. For example, the percentage of coal use for electricity in the U.S. accounts for about 90%, Canada 85%, Germany 81%, the UK 75%, Russia 64%, and the global average is approximately 78%. China should increase the proportion of coal used for electricity, and also increase the proportion of electricity as the source of end-use energy consumption.

http://cornerstonemag.net/pollution-control-of-coal-fired-power-generation-in-china-an-interview-with-wang-zhixuan/

Comment on Mark Steyn’s new book on Michael Mann by John Sidles

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matthewrmarler wonders  “Would you like to return to discussing the merits of Mann v Steyn and Steyn v Mann?”

Answer For the overwhelming majority of mathematicians, scientists, and engineers, the simple answer is “no”.

Because:

• The legal merits of Mann vs Steyn and Steyn vs Man are contingent upon arcane legal minutiae that have no scientific interest whatsover.

• The scientific merits (if any) of these two cases are unlikely to be credibly decided in any court of law … and to date, haven’t even been argued.

That’s why sensible mathematicians, scientists, and engineers (and sensible citizens too) are devoting far more attention to the scientifically credible and ethically mature ideas that Jim, Kathy, Francis, Wendell, and Randall are expressing … than to the juvenile legal and personal squabblings of Mark and Michael.

Sensible conclusion  Mark should apologize and Michael should accept that apology … because nowadays not many sober science-minded folks care at all about their two-clown legal circus.

Comment on Mark Steyn’s new book on Michael Mann by Jim D

Comment on Week in review – science edition by mwgrant

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Ron Graf – why or you all excited? The is “never” is not correct but that the western did react when it occurred. That is pretty simple. Take a deep breath.

Comment on Week in review – science edition by Jim D

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captd, those numbers look completely wrong. Electricity generation by coal in the US is less than half and declining. China also has other options: solar, nuclear, hydro, wind.


Comment on Week in review – science edition by mwgrant

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Ron is not the only one that should take a deep breath. Ron Graf – why <i>are</i> you all excited? The <i>"is</i> never” is not correct but that the western <i>world</i>did react when it occurred <i>is correct</i>. That is pretty simple. Take a deep breath.

Comment on Week in review – science edition by Jim D

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OK, I see , it is percentage of coal used for electricity generation, not percentage of electricity generation by coal. Big difference.

Comment on Mark Steyn’s new book on Michael Mann by AK

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<blockquote>In academia, fraud has a much more serious meaning and proven academic fraud can cost tenure, but at the same time it is more narrowly defined than the general usage. Is Steyn implying academic fraud?</blockquote>He's writing opinion, in an opinion-dominated venue. He's speaking metaphorically, at least. If he claims he was doing only that, that the "fraud" was a metaphor for a deliberate deception (provable) that <b>in his opinion</b> was the moral equivalent of “<i>academic fraud</i>”, my guess is that would be not-actionable.<blockquote>There is no fraud because he can show the data and the methods that led to his results. You may disagree with the data and/or methods, but that comes down to a difference of opinion which does not rise to the level of academic fraud.</blockquote>IIRC the methods he <b>claimed</b> he used, against the data he <b>claimed</b> he used, was demonstrated not to produce the results he <b>claimed</b>. When it comes to Steyn, IIRC at the time that statement was made, Mann was continuing to refuse to produce all the necessary information to allow a successful "clean-room" replication of his <b>claimed</b> results. In which case a presumption of guilt for “<i>academic fraud</i>” would have been entirely in order in an opinion piece.

Comment on ‘Climate culture’ versus ‘knowing disbelief’ by matthewrmarler

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Andy West, thank you for a good post.

Comment on Mark Steyn’s new book on Michael Mann by catweazle666

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“Sensible conclusion”?

Johnny boy, you wouldn’t recognise a sensible conclusion if it scampered under your foetid, slimy bridge, leapt up, and bit you on the snout.

But hey, keep up the good work, every good blog needs a comedian, and you fulfil the function beautifully.

Comment on ‘Climate culture’ versus ‘knowing disbelief’ by AK

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<blockquote>One group believes what they read in or about scientific journal papers, and the other doesn’t.</blockquote>Correctamundo! And the group that “<i>believes what they read in or about scientific journal papers</i>” <b>does not include any real scientists.</b> No true scientist would “<i>believes</i>” something they read in a scientific journal without considering the probabilities of error, non-replicatability, and other reasons <b>true scientists</b> are always skeptical. And no sane person “<i>believes</i>” anything they read in the MSM without a hefty dose of skepticism.

Comment on Mark Steyn’s new book on Michael Mann by Jim D

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As I mention elsewhere, his best chance of winning would be the judgment that any reasonable person would not believe that Steyn is qualified or knowledgeable enough about the issue to make his statement, so it should not be taken seriously and more as some form of satire.


Comment on Week in review – science edition by captdallas2 0.8 +/- 0.3

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JimD, “OK, I see , it is percentage of coal used for electricity generation, not percentage of electricity generation by coal. Big difference.”

Right. The Chinese coal power plants actually have more scrubbers installed than the US as a percentage of capacity. However, if half the coal isn’t burned in power plants that doesn’t do much good. The Chinese are also just starting to match US road vehicle fuel standards and just like the US the Off Road fuels used at ports and container rail yards are still going to be a problem. They would be better off using natural gas in off road equipment than in power plants.

Comment on ‘Climate culture’ versus ‘knowing disbelief’ by Jim D

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AK, OK, so you take issue with the word “believe”. How about “accept as more likely true than not” given that papers come with evidence and are built on previous evidence.

Comment on Mark Steyn’s new book on Michael Mann by jamesbbkk

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Steyn filed an anti-SLAPP motion and things promptly went off the rails. That’s when he tried to take it to merits. The other side went for delay. It has gone this far only thusly.

Comment on Week in review – science edition by jim2

Comment on Mark Steyn’s new book on Michael Mann by jamesbbkk

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It is a case about free speech. So there’s that. Enjoy yours while it lasts.

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