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Comment on Week in review – science edition by climatereason

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Faustino

I did pose that question 8 hours ago

http://judithcurry.com/2015/11/13/week-in-review-science-edition-27/#comment-743409

I suppose you are going to use the excuse that you were asleep….?

Mind you, everyone on this blog seems to have carried on with their squabbling not realising what a potentially big deal this is. Can the French authorities protect 40000 delegates to a scientific conference and the 100 world leaders that will turn up to sign things?

Not in my opinion. An attack on a UN conference would be a pr coup for the terrorists. I really can’t see it going ahead in the form originally propoed.

tonyb


Comment on Week in review – science edition by Faustino aka Genghis Cunn

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Mike, that’s a funny way to spell Bob Dylan.

Comment on Week in review – politics and policy edition by ristvan

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RS, I was only speaking about oil.
Surely there are many other Saudi interests not going to plan. Yemen and Syria come to mind. BTW, have you ever been there and interacted with their officials? I have. Almost all sharp and western trained. The five prayer sessions per day thing was, I admit, a bit disruptive to my western long session negotiating style.

Comment on Hiatus controversy: show me the data by Jim D

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Mears, also rather unhelpfully to Smith’s case said
“Mears, March 24: All datasets contain errors. In this case, I would trust the surface data a little more because the difference between the long term trends in the various surface datasets (NOAA, NASA GISS, HADCRUT, Berkeley, etc) are closer to each other than the long term trends from the different satellite datasets. This suggests that the satellite datasets contain more “structural uncertainty” than the surface dataset.”
Is Smith going to target Mears with a subpoena next?

Comment on Week in review – politics and policy edition by ianl8888

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> If France cancels, Daesh ‘wins’ in PR–look how mighty we are

Yes

I suspect that is a prime reason for the timing of the atrocities in Paris. The attention of western MSM is concentrating on the imminent COP21, so maximum publicity, fear and panic are absolutely guaranteed

Comment on Week in review – politics and policy edition by ROM

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Whenever you’re faced with an explanation of what’s going on in Washington, the choice between incompetence and conspiracy, always choose incompetence.

Charles Krauthammer

Comment on Hiatus controversy: show me the data by micro6500

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Mears, also rather unhelpfully to Smith’s case said
“Mears, March 24: All datasets contain errors. In this case, I would trust the surface data a little more because the difference between the long term trends in the various surface datasets (NOAA, NASA GISS, HADCRUT, Berkeley, etc) are closer to each other than the long term trends from the different satellite datasets. This suggests that the satellite datasets contain more “structural uncertainty” than the surface dataset.”

Or that the surface datasets are looking at the wrong thing and following the same ham-fisted method of making up data.

Comment on Week in review – politics and policy edition by jim2

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I’m not so sure, given the missed predictions that shale oil would be more expensive that it now is, that Saudi Arabia’s plans are going great for them. They are losing a ton of money keeping the price of oil down. I think they may be doing it to hurt Russia and Iran as much as to hurt the US.


Comment on Hiatus controversy: show me the data by Jim D

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So should Smith target Mears to see exactly what he means when he says satellite temperature trends show “structural uncertainties” due to not agreeing with each other? It seems Smith should be very interested in that owing to his desire to get the best possible temperature record, and he would not want to be relying on something with “structural uncertainties” when he makes a case against Karl.

Comment on Hiatus controversy: show me the data by PA

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All the datasets could be problematic. Scientists seem to fall in love with their methodologies, and finding scientific misuse of statistics seems to be like shooting fish in a barrel with a minigun.

A combined engineering/statistical team should evaluate the temperature datasets and weigh in on methodology, accuracy, precision, and error sources/error bounds.

Someone objective needs to evaluate the various data products to see if any of them are suitable for the purposes intended..

Comment on Hiatus controversy: show me the data by Jim D

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It should be a clue to them when the providers of one dataset point to another one as being better.

Comment on Week in review – politics and policy edition by Curious George

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I have such a fear that 4100 best people on the planet (40000 delegates and 100 leaders) may be putting themselves in danger for the sake of the rest of us. Imagine a nightmarish scenario should we have to live without them.

Comment on Week in review – politics and policy edition by matthewrmarler

Comment on Week in review – politics and policy edition by Don Monfort

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The underlying logic actually is not far fetched. Gross industrial over capacity is the reality in China. Economic growth by willy-nilly capital investment is over. Greenpeace understates that problem. It worse than they think.

About the only reliable economic stats that you get from China are the electricity usage numbers that come from China Electricity Council. I watch them closely, as I got a lot of money bet on the bubble bursting:

http://articles.economictimes.indiatimes.com/2015-11-06/news/68071447_1_coal-miners-china-electricity-council-new-coal-fired-power-plants

China should stop adding new coal-fired power plants: State researchers
Reuters Nov 6, 2015, 01.54PM IST

BEIJING: China should slow down its expansion plans for coal-fired power plants to take account of an expected decline in demand from energy-intensive industries such as steel and cement, said researchers at government-backed think tanks.

The world’s biggest coal consumer has seen a boom in construction of coal-fired plants, increasing new capacity by 55 percent in the first six months compared with the same period last year, according to the China Electricity Council.

It also approved 200 gigawatts of new plants in the first half of 2015, exceeding the total approvals in the previous three years, said Yuan Jiahai, a professor at the North China Electric Power University.

Expected production cuts by industry could mean a severe oversupply of coal-fired power, he said.

“If it keeps on growing with no control, the oversupply troubling the steel and cement industries would be even worse for the power sector,” said Yuan.

China’s steel sector currently has 300 million tonnes of surplus capacity.

Coal consumption by cement makers and steel firms will see coal use peak by 2016, according to the think tanks.

Coal consumption by power stations will likely peak by 2020, their research found.

Growth in coal consumption is already falling and could be the slowest in 30 years in 2015, said Miao Ren, a researcher at the Energy Research Institute.

The institute operates under the Chinese government’s top planning body, the National Development and Reform Commission.

Miao said overall energy consumption would rise only 1 percent this year, compared with an average of 4.3 per cent growth in previous years.

China’s GDP is expected to grow 7 per cent this year, down from 7.3 percent in 2014.

Thermal power plants are set to cut operating hours by nearly 400 hours this year as the economy slows.

http://articles.economictimes.indiatimes.com/2015-11-06/news/68071447_1_coal-miners-china-electricity-council-new-coal-fired-power-plants

China should stop adding new coal-fired power plants: State researchers
Reuters Nov 6, 2015, 01.54PM IST

BEIJING: China should slow down its expansion plans for coal-fired power plants to take account of an expected decline in demand from energy-intensive industries such as steel and cement, said researchers at government-backed think tanks.

The world’s biggest coal consumer has seen a boom in construction of coal-fired plants, increasing new capacity by 55 percent in the first six months compared with the same period last year, according to the China Electricity Council.

It also approved 200 gigawatts of new plants in the first half of 2015, exceeding the total approvals in the previous three years, said Yuan Jiahai, a professor at the North China Electric Power University.

Expected production cuts by industry could mean a severe oversupply of coal-fired power, he said.

“If it keeps on growing with no control, the oversupply troubling the steel and cement industries would be even worse for the power sector,” said Yuan.

China’s steel sector currently has 300 million tonnes of surplus capacity.

Coal consumption by cement makers and steel firms will see coal use peak by 2016, according to the think tanks.

Coal consumption by power stations will likely peak by 2020, their research found.

Growth in coal consumption is already falling and could be the slowest in 30 years in 2015, said Miao Ren, a researcher at the Energy Research Institute.

The institute operates under the Chinese government’s top planning body, the National Development and Reform Commission.

Miao said overall energy consumption would rise only 1 percent this year, compared with an average of 4.3 per cent growth in previous years.

China’s GDP is expected to grow 7 per cent this year, down from 7.3 percent in 2014.

Thermal power plants are set to cut operating hours by nearly 400 hours this year as the economy slows.

Comment on Week in review – science edition by RiHo08

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All you offer are words. Is that sufficient? I believe not.

Our President offers…what? more of the same: bad behavior. Rewards in the political arena.

Divine intervention is not only unlikely, but, according to pundits, climate scientists, and those with a malevolent agenda, these will succeed. Much the pity.


Comment on Hiatus controversy: show me the data by PA

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It is a little more complicated than that.

The TLT datasets really only measure down to 1.5 km at best which is above the ABL

The .land datasets measure at head top level (at least for me). This is at the bottom of the ABL.

The ocean datasets measure as far as I can reach down with a bucket. This is below the ABL.

The land and ocean datasets really don’t have anything to do with each other and we combine them anyway.

A independent team needs look at the datasets and determine if any of them provide value.

They might. They might not. Perhaps something completely different should be done. The “climate” datasets have mutated from what was weather data. Someone needs to do a sanity check.

Comment on Week in review – politics and policy edition by mosomoso

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While nothing is certain, COP 21 should be fine with most Islamist crazies. Only the craziest crazies could object.

Climate alarmism favours Big Oil over coal but pushes the price of all fossil fuels higher and adds new demand at a time when other factors are repressing oil and gas prices. After all, domestic coal power is not supplanted by wind and solar but by gas, oil and imported coal power. (Check out “wind-miracle” South Australia’s gas and diesel bill, on top of its electricity imports from brown-coal burning Victoria.)

Ruinously expensive renewables are the new burden of the old First World, while the new First World of Asia – they’re the guys who make all your stuff – make flimsy promises and mumble pieties on the subject of emissions. What’s not to like in all that if you are a nutbag Islamist?

At a time when the West should be doing everything to maximise domestic energy you have a POTUS hostile to Keystone, coal and nukes. Coal, LNG and uranium rich Australia can’t wait to become one of Gaia’s basket cases. Britain incinerates American forests for its electricity and has to wonder if Russian gas or Qatari gas will be the better geopolitical decision in this naughty world.

I’m sure there are jihadis crazy enough to attack COP 21, but the shrewd one will clap it along, maybe even hand out free kebabs to the delegates.

Comment on Hiatus controversy: show me the data by micro6500

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” A independent team needs look at the datasets and determine if any of them provide value.

They might. They might not. Perhaps something completely different should be done”

I’m an independent data specialist, and I’ve done something completely different.

And there’s no loss of nightly cooling since 1940.

Comment on Hiatus controversy: show me the data by Jim D

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PA, with satellites it is much more complicated than that. A series of 10-15 satellites provide this dataset over the period since 1979, each with their own calibrations and drifts. This is what provides structural uncertainties. Some might say that the true signal is irretrievable from them because there are no independent measures to check with.

Comment on Hiatus controversy: show me the data by PA

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Jim D | November 14, 2015 at 8:20 pm |
PA, with satellites it is much more complicated than that. A series of 10-15 satellites provide this dataset over the period since 1979, each with their own calibrations and drifts.

The ABL ends at about 450 m so the surface measures really don’t tell you anything about the atmosphere.

The data sets are as different as cats, dogs, and badgers. The cats and badgers are kept in cages and the dogs are observed with binoculars.

The surface people combine cats and badgers to produce a hairy mammal data set (LOTI=HMDS).

There are problems with all the data sets. An independent audit is needed to evaluate if what is being done makes sense and pick between bad and worse.

If you are claiming the surface measures are superior … There isn’t the data available to support or refute the conclusion (please provide a link to an independent audit that supports your conclusion if you have one). The satellite data sets are more consistent and there is a maxim that it is better to be consistent than to be right. It certainly is less impeded by other human influences.

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