Comment on The Fundamental Uncertainties of Climate Change by David Springer

January 9, 2014, 2:07 pm

≫ Next: Comment on The Fundamental Uncertainties of Climate Change by Fernando Leanme

≪ Previous: Comment on The Fundamental Uncertainties of Climate Change by Don Monfort

$

0

0

The citation must be to myself since I didn’t read it anywhere. I sincerely doubt I’m the only person to have envisioned clouds as a maximum entropy situation.

Which links did you follow from the wickedpedia article on Prigogine?

I suggest reading linked article on dissipative systems and the other on self organizing systems. The gist of it is that self-organizing dissipative systems (Prigogine uses river patterns on continents as an example) organize themselves such that maximum possible entropy is produced given the physical constraints of the system under consideration.

So rivers flow in such a way that they reach the ocean in the most efficient way possible given the terrain to be traversed. I’m saying that clouds self-organize into the most efficient configuration possible for maximum entropy (dissipating heat) in a system far from equilibrium.

Adding CO2 to the atmosphere is then equivalent to putting an obstacle in the way of a river. The river will find the most efficient way around the obstacle. Similarly clouds will adjust to find the most efficient way to dissipate heat.

---

Comment on The Fundamental Uncertainties of Climate Change by Fernando Leanme

January 9, 2014, 2:09 pm

≫ Next: Comment on CAGW memeplex by Jani

≪ Previous: Comment on The Fundamental Uncertainties of Climate Change by David Springer

$

0

0

Luis you can promote all sorts of ideas such as “social solidarity” on the back of the global warming debate. And I can also smell a dead rat in such proposals because if your aim is to impose communism I’ve first hand and lengthy exposure to communist dictatorships and their aftermath, and I’d rather not undergo the experience ever again. This means I’m not going to look kindly on the use of global warming propaganda to return me to slavery.

Comment on CAGW memeplex by Jani

January 9, 2014, 2:09 pm

≫ Next: Comment on The Fundamental Uncertainties of Climate Change by Max_OK, Citizen Scientist

≪ Previous: Comment on The Fundamental Uncertainties of Climate Change by Fernando Leanme

$

0

0

Gently file the nails to the shape and length that you desire.

Other dish detergents now have hand softeners in them.
It can be a great reward for them and an effective motivational return for you.

Comment on The Fundamental Uncertainties of Climate Change by Max_OK, Citizen Scientist

January 9, 2014, 2:12 pm

≫ Next: Comment on The Fundamental Uncertainties of Climate Change by Mi Cro

≪ Previous: Comment on CAGW memeplex by Jani

$

0

0

Hello, Detroit Don

I’m afraid I inadvertently suckered you by not quoting Pew in more detail. Read the following and you will see what I mean.

“Democrats are far more supportive than Republicans of stricter emission limits on power plants to address climate change; 74% of Democrats favor this compared with 67% of independents and 52% of Republicans. Still, even among Republicans there is more support than opposition to emission limits (52% favor, 43% oppose).”

http://www.people-press.org/2013/09/26/continued-support-for-keystone-xl-pipeline/

Don, I’m appaled at how little you know about cars. The most efficient cars weigh a lot more than 800 lbs. The Smart Electric , which is close to the lightest if not the lightest of the efficiency champs, starts at 1.600 lbs, and most of them weigh a lot more.

Comment on The Fundamental Uncertainties of Climate Change by Mi Cro

January 9, 2014, 2:18 pm

≫ Next: Comment on The Fundamental Uncertainties of Climate Change by David Springer

≪ Previous: Comment on The Fundamental Uncertainties of Climate Change by Max_OK, Citizen Scientist

$

0

0

I am with webby on this one, Micro. I bet you he can use that SEASALT gizmo to duplicate the other temp series to a gnat’s eyela.. No wait. Let’s go with elephant’s trunk. No! No! whale’s belly.

:) If he was really good he’d use it to predict next weeks NASDAQ results.

Comment on The Fundamental Uncertainties of Climate Change by David Springer

January 9, 2014, 2:21 pm

≫ Next: Comment on The Fundamental Uncertainties of Climate Change by Scott

≪ Previous: Comment on The Fundamental Uncertainties of Climate Change by Mi Cro

$

0

0

I’ll search for the response asking for clarification on Prigogine.

My encounter with his work was associated with some forgotten person who wrote (seriously I think) that humans are part of a self-organizing dissipative system (i.e. the earth) and our activities are hastening it reaching maximum entropy (i.e. we’re making it hotter, blowing it to smithereens with nuclear weapons, and so forth). This therefore he went on explains the course of evolution which is just the far from equilibrium system finding the most efficient way to achieve maximum entropy.

I thought it was stretching Prigogine’s work a bit too far but I don’t have a problem with clouds, which are a helluva lot simpler than a human mind, being agents of maxEnt.

Comment on The Fundamental Uncertainties of Climate Change by Scott

January 9, 2014, 2:24 pm

≫ Next: Comment on The Fundamental Uncertainties of Climate Change by Max_OK, Citizen Scientist

≪ Previous: Comment on The Fundamental Uncertainties of Climate Change by David Springer

$

0

0

Joz,
Another place to look for cloud information from NASA is the Cloudsat reference page
http://www.nasa.gov/cloudsat

a quick reference quide says it rpovides teh first global survey of cloud profiles and geographic variations from space.

Some clouds are dark and absorb energy, some bright and reflect and and all hard to model realistically in current GCMs.
Scott

Comment on The Fundamental Uncertainties of Climate Change by Max_OK, Citizen Scientist

January 9, 2014, 2:24 pm

≫ Next: Comment on The Fundamental Uncertainties of Climate Change by R. Gates, Skeptical Warmist

≪ Previous: Comment on The Fundamental Uncertainties of Climate Change by Scott

$

0

0

COMMUNIST CONSPIRACY ALERT !

OK, I’ll confess. I think man-made global is a bad thing because I’m some kind of “ist”, probably an enlightened capitalist.

---

Comment on The Fundamental Uncertainties of Climate Change by R. Gates, Skeptical Warmist

January 10, 2014, 12:08 pm

≫ Next: Comment on The Fundamental Uncertainties of Climate Change by WebHubTelescope (@whut)

≪ Previous: Comment on The Fundamental Uncertainties of Climate Change by Max_OK, Citizen Scientist

$

0

0

Yep, watch out for those craziers who think volcanoes might impact the climate for more than a year. There’s a nice chart on bottom of page 7 of this report:

http://www.sdstate.edu/chem/faculty/jihong-cole-dai/upload/Volcanoes-and-Climate-10-1002-wcc-76.pdf

That diplays a curious lull in volcanic activity around the MWP. Must just be coincidence.

Comment on The Fundamental Uncertainties of Climate Change by WebHubTelescope (@whut)

January 10, 2014, 12:12 pm

≫ Next: Comment on The Fundamental Uncertainties of Climate Change by David Springer

≪ Previous: Comment on The Fundamental Uncertainties of Climate Change by R. Gates, Skeptical Warmist

$

0

0

Micro, As a suggestion, you should clean up your own mess first. I looked at your site and find it incomprehensible.

I do borrow ideas from skeptics, but not from your analysis of Tmax and Tmin.

If you take the difference of Tmax and Tmin from each day, and then successively sum these over a range of days, you end up with the difference between the endpoints. You probably aren’t doing something that dumb, but hard to tell from your charts.

You clearly think that the scientists at NASA and NOAA have messed up the global temperature averaging, and that everyone who has depended on this data for their own research is now working with suspect temperature time series.

Comment on The Fundamental Uncertainties of Climate Change by David Springer

January 10, 2014, 12:16 pm

≫ Next: Comment on Is global warming causing the polar vortex? by Derek H

≪ Previous: Comment on The Fundamental Uncertainties of Climate Change by WebHubTelescope (@whut)

$

0

0

otters playing basketball – brotters by anotter motter

Comment on Is global warming causing the polar vortex? by Derek H

January 10, 2014, 12:16 pm

≫ Next: Comment on The Fundamental Uncertainties of Climate Change by David Springer

≪ Previous: Comment on The Fundamental Uncertainties of Climate Change by David Springer

$

0

0

Max, what bogus reporting on Climategate are you referring to? The mainstream media tried to avoid reporting on it at first then referred to it as a hacking incident. Are you saying various “leading lights” of the climate “science” community did NOT talk about preventing publication of papers with contrarian views and data?

or that the code published not only didn’t match what Mann et all used to produce their graphs but that it didn’t produce hockey sticks from pink noise data that had nothing to do with climate?

or that some of the e-mails in question were NOT a conspiracy to prevent release of data in response to legitimate FOIA requests?

I would really like to know what lies and bogus reporting you are referring to. Thanks.

Comment on The Fundamental Uncertainties of Climate Change by David Springer

January 10, 2014, 12:25 pm

≫ Next: Comment on The Fundamental Uncertainties of Climate Change by Derek H

≪ Previous: Comment on Is global warming causing the polar vortex? by Derek H

$

0

0

climatereason | January 10, 2014 at 2:49 pm | Reply
RGates

I refrained from making a comment about otters. I had merely thought that CE was becoming ever more surreal what with otters, numerous sock puppets and some guys belief that volcanic aerosols cools for decades. :)

Tonyb
——————————————————————
I wish I could risk replying as Admiral Abba.

Nevertheless I think the following sums up the situation from my POV near the Alamo.

Comment on The Fundamental Uncertainties of Climate Change by Derek H

January 10, 2014, 12:38 pm

≫ Next: Comment on The Fundamental Uncertainties of Climate Change by Mi Cro

≪ Previous: Comment on The Fundamental Uncertainties of Climate Change by David Springer

$

0

0

It would have been clearer if threading worked properly here but your comment that I was responding to was your response at 10:15 am:

David Springer | January 9, 2014 at 10:15 am | Reply

Don’t believe everything you read. Discover Magazine is not a peer reviewed journal.

Nice try but no cigar.

willard’s post of 8:12 pm on Jan 8 was the only one to reference Discover Magazine so you were obviously responding to that post and no other. It’s pretty clear that you didn’t read that article in question enough to realize it was not the paper itself but was simply citing the paper’s publication. I know neither of you nor your history with one another, I just figured one snarky response deserved another. ;)

Comment on The Fundamental Uncertainties of Climate Change by Mi Cro

January 10, 2014, 12:39 pm

≫ Next: Comment on The Fundamental Uncertainties of Climate Change by David Springer

≪ Previous: Comment on The Fundamental Uncertainties of Climate Change by Derek H

$

0

0

You’re not the first to look it over (and there are a number of pages that fit together), you are the first who couldn’t understand it, but it’s me.

But I’ll make it simple, for a single station I take todays Tmax, and subtract yesterdays Tmax from it. That’s MX Diff. I take today’s Tmin, and subtract yesterdays Tmin, that’s Min Diff. I also on a different article calculate today’s temp increase (rise), and last nights falling temp (fall).
Then I average the daily value for a collection of stations into a daily average, and if I want I average the same collection of daily values for a period of a year. I’ve done daily and yearly averages for Tmin, Tmax, MX Diff, MN Diff, Mean Temp, surface pressure, rain, and then look at these values by year or day depending on what I want to look at.

---

Comment on The Fundamental Uncertainties of Climate Change by David Springer

January 10, 2014, 12:39 pm

≫ Next: Comment on The Fundamental Uncertainties of Climate Change by Wagathon

≪ Previous: Comment on The Fundamental Uncertainties of Climate Change by Mi Cro

$

0

0

HELLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLP!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

New article please!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!11

Comment on The Fundamental Uncertainties of Climate Change by Wagathon

January 10, 2014, 12:48 pm

≫ Next: Comment on The Fundamental Uncertainties of Climate Change by Wagathon

≪ Previous: Comment on The Fundamental Uncertainties of Climate Change by David Springer

$

0

0

'Ya, ain't those <em>enfants sauvages</em> just the cutest?

Comment on The Fundamental Uncertainties of Climate Change by Wagathon

January 10, 2014, 12:49 pm

≫ Next: Comment on The Fundamental Uncertainties of Climate Change by Generalissimo Skippy

≪ Previous: Comment on The Fundamental Uncertainties of Climate Change by Wagathon

$

0

0

There otter be a law or something.

Comment on The Fundamental Uncertainties of Climate Change by Generalissimo Skippy

January 10, 2014, 12:51 pm

≫ Next: Comment on The Fundamental Uncertainties of Climate Change by Peter Lang

≪ Previous: Comment on The Fundamental Uncertainties of Climate Change by Wagathon

$

0

0

To go just one step further. ENSO, PDO and the AMO are intimately related in what we are coming to call the stadium wave – and cause surface temperature variability on a minimum of decadal scales.

The original Tsonis paper on climate shifts shows quantitatively shows the connections and is suggestive of the stadium wave.

http://heartland.org/sites/all/modules/custom/heartland_migration/files/pdfs/21743.pdf

Comment on The Fundamental Uncertainties of Climate Change by Peter Lang

January 10, 2014, 1:14 pm

≫ Next: Comment on The Fundamental Uncertainties of Climate Change by Herman Alexander Pope

≪ Previous: Comment on The Fundamental Uncertainties of Climate Change by Generalissimo Skippy

$

0

0

From GWPF newsletter:

“China approved the construction of more than 100 million tonnes of new coal production capacity in 2013 – six times more than a year earlier and equal to 10 percent of U.S. annual usage – flying in the face of plans to tackle choking air pollution. The scale of the increase, which only includes major mines, reflects Beijing’s aim to put 860 million tonnes of new coal production capacity into operation over the five years to 2015, more than the entire annual output of India.” –David Stanway, Reuters, 7 January 2014

“It’s been a black Christmas for green thinkers as Germany, the world leader in rooftop solar and pride of the renewable energy revolution has confirmed its rapid return to coal. The past week has seen a media focus on Europe’s building “coal frenzy”. It all adds up to the renewable energy industry’s worst nightmare.” — Graham Lloyd, The Australian, 11 January 2014